The PPM Method for Mastering Disruption with Chris Marshall TB

Chris Marshall's PPM Guide to Disruption

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Welcome back to The Daily Mastermind, everyone, George Wright III with your daily dose of inspiration, motivation, and education.

And I'm joined by an amazing guest today. I'm really super excited about this topic and this amazing uncertainty scientist, which I'm gonna introduce in a minute here. But Chris Marshall, welcome to the podcast.

I'm really good. Thank you. And thank you so much for having me on. This is great.

No, listen, I know we were coordinating, trying to pull this together, but before we get going, I gotta just give a little bit of background. Sometimes I just wing it, but you've got some really interesting stuff here. So I want everyone to know your background.

Chris is a behavioral scientist and professional futurist. We're gonna talk a little bit about that in a minute here, but he helps CEOs, business leaders, and investment professionals basically navigate the coming era of radical change. And listen, everybody listening to this knows there's massive change happening. But as a thought leader, he brings not only his wealth of insights from research but also his personal stories and experience.

He had his own burnout, anxiety, and stress—stuff that a lot of you I know work with. He's gone from athlete to financial behavioral finance analyst to now his passion. He wrote a book called Decoding Change, and he's developed a PM method, which we'll talk about. But the idea here is to help individuals like you, CEOs, entrepreneurs, and investors, navigate the rapid-changing world.

Chris, we have a lot of things to dig into, but I wanted to give that intro because it shows that, from our initial conversation, people might think, "Man, this guy is just really smart." But you've really gone through several different types of phases in your life.

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Chris Marshall's Background and Journey

Yeah, absolutely. I'd love to. For me, I guess it has to start with psychology. That's where it all originates for me. I was a youth athlete in alpine skiing, and it was actually out in Vermont, in the Green Mountains in Killington, where I came across this incredible sports psychologist when I was about 13 years old.

And he just absolutely floored me with this phrase. He sat this group down in front of him. We were all silent, cross-legged on the floor. And he just goes, "I want you to understand there's a physical game and there's a mental game." And as this 13-year-old athlete, I just remember sitting there going, "Oh, my word."

I'd never even realized this. All I'd done was spend all my time in the gym and on the ski slope. I never even thought about the mental game. I was actually a fairly anxious athlete. So, I'm autistic—not that it necessarily makes me an anxious athlete, but it did. And so this idea of a mental game really transformed my early childhood and certainly that early athlete career.

Then, after I stopped racing, I had to find a proper job. I ended up in one of the global banks during the financial crisis of '07, '08, '09, '10, '11—as it went on and on. And I naturally gravitated back toward behavioral finance. I loved the world of finance because it was fast-paced, moving, and chaotic.

It was this real-life simulation of what people were feeling from a sentiment basis. So, behavioral finance grabbed me. And then I found futures work or foresight work, which is looking out to the far horizon, looking at weak signals, and looking at trends and megatrends.

Normally, futures work and behavioral science are kept as separate disciplines. They borrow tools from each other every now and again, but in general, they're separate. And what I wanted to do was bring those two together because I just couldn't see that you can understand change without understanding how we navigate change.

Yeah, I love what you said. I wanna pause you for a second 'cause I don't wanna miss this. The point is, we have such a parallel. I know we've identified this kind of parallel path.

And before you finish your story, I think it's important for people to understand and note that even as an athlete—and it's so funny to me—it’s so specific that no matter where you are, business, athlete, whatever it is, the most successful people know there's a mental and physical game. And you caught that early on, and more people are trying to pick that up.

But you basically went from being an athlete who noticed that into finance, behavioral finance. And I love the fact that you were aware—consciously aware—of where you wanted to go. It seemed like no matter what the field was, you were going where your passion was, where you wanted to go. And so, I love that. So, keep going with your story, but I think that mental and physical game is so key to a lot of what we're gonna be talking about. So, I wanted to point that out to everybody.

Yeah, absolutely. And it's so well understood in the sporting arena. It's so well understood in elite military. It's so well understood in, let's say, astronauts—people who are pushing themselves. But in the business arena, very few leaders understand it to the degree that they should anyway.

So, coming back to that story, yeah, absolutely. I’d found futures work, looking at the horizon, and I realized that I really wanted to pull these two fields together.

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Decoding Change: Understanding and Adapting

And so that was the research and the motivation, if you like, behind the book Decoding Change. I wanted to show people how the world was changing because, again, we've had this conversation where people are very rigid. They live in this silo.

The most dangerous phrase in the English language is, "This is the way I've always done it." The issue with that phrase is the world around you is always changing, and so if you just do what you've always done, at some point you're completely disengaged and out of kilter.

Yes, you are redundant, essentially. Not only disconnected, but it causes a mental frustration for you because you are disconnected, and you just don't know how. You don't understand why.

Absolutely. And we could name loads of businesses that have fallen into this trap—Kodak, BlackBerry, Blockbuster. We could just keep going. But if you're not connected, then you simply can't be at the forefront of your business.

What I wanted to do with Decoding Change was push against the common narrative, which was, "If you want to know more, you have to dig deeper. You have to read more. You have to cut back on your sleep," or whatever you need to do.

In a fast-changing world, it's actually a shift from being a hyper-specialist to a generalist. It's a shift from being everything right at you to stepping back. Decoding Change actually lays out all of these massive trends and megatrends going on around us. They're the real forces behind everything we see changing.

It brings in some of the behavioral science as to why we don't see it. It could be that we're just pinned to the current narrative by mass media or pinned to a very negative narrative by mass media. Or it could be that we're just running with this prior belief, which has no foundation at all, and we just go around finding information to support it.

Decoding Change is this invitation to take a massive, deep breath, stand back, and see how the world’s changing. The issue came within the middle of that research. I basically fell down and was like, "Oh my word, the level of disruption we're about to face as businesses, individuals, households, and communities is not akin to the First Industrial Revolution."

That was seismic in itself. But what we're about to face is as big a magnitude, in my eyes anyway, as it was 10,000 years ago when we stopped being hunter-gatherers and became a settled agrarian society. That's how fundamental I think this disruption period is going to be over the next few decades.

Listen, Chris, this is a huge point that I want to point out to our listeners because they might just really be understanding and loving what you're saying. But what you are saying—and what I think—you've done this before. You've asked people, "Would you agree that things are in a state of change?"

And I think most people—I know everyone listening to this podcast—will probably say, "Yeah, there's massive change going on." If you just look at the last two, three years, let alone the trends, there's massive change. But what you're saying is this is literally one of the biggest changes—for sure the biggest type of change and trends that's going to happen in a lifetime right now. This is that big, is what you're saying?

So the level of change that we're seeing and the pace of change—it’s not actually just the magnitude; it’s also the pace. And that’s very much brought on by the technologies we have going around us.

Let’s bring this back to Decoding Change. The point was that I uncovered this and saw it with my own eyes—just this level of change, magnitude, disruption, and everything else.

Then, with that rubber band effect, it was almost like, "Oh my word, I’ve got to go back towards psychology again."

I’d written the book, which helps people see change, but there’s little point in being able to see it if you can’t cope with it. That was when I said, "Okay, let’s go back to a blank slate. Let’s devise a program or a process that really brings people in and teaches them how to navigate the most punishing environments."

I honestly believe the tools we’ve been offered previously do not match what we need in the future. And that’s where the PM method—or Pause, Play, Move method—came in.

And I want to go through that as well. But Chris, one thing I want to point out to everybody listening—and it’s very important—is that as with anything in life, you have to create awareness. You have to understand and recognize what the change is. That’s what you’ve done with your book Decoding Change, right?

But then you realized that we needed strategies and tactics to adapt to that. And I think most people are a little lost right now—they’re needing some strategies and tactics to deal with it. And the point you brought up that I want to just really emphasize is that the types of strategies and tactics that have worked to deal with change in the past and uncertainty aren’t what work now because of the level and speed of the type of change that’s happening.

So that’s a critical point people need to understand.

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The PM Method: Pause, Play, Move

So, the PM method just stands for Pause, Play, Move, which is a three-step process. I believe that most of our focus over the past few hundred years—certainly within business—has been on the move. We’ve developed KPIs, goals, efficiency, and we work these hours, and we do this. That’s all the move, okay?

And it’s great—we can juice out efficiency, and that’s amazing. It’s done some great things. But as soon as you start adding in chaos, ambiguity, uncertainty, and complexity, then actually it’s the bit you feed into the move that matters more than the move.

It’s not just about, “Okay, we’re seeing disruption. We need to work harder now.” If you look at the stats of workplace burnout, anxiety, stress, overwhelm, and job satisfaction—all of these are actually at pivotal moments. They’ve been rising massively since the 1980s, and they’re not slowing.

In fact, we see it certainly in the younger generation. And this is a real issue because—and I’m sure we’re going to touch on this—when you’re stressed, your relationships, decision-making, creativity, and outlook all change.

Yeah, and I do want to point out and agree wholeheartedly with what you’re saying. Because most people listening to this podcast—and most high achievers, we’ll call them high achievers, entrepreneurs, CEOs—they know that success, at least to this point, likes speed. They like to move; they like to create; they like to just keep going, get the grind, get the KPIs, and movement.

And what you’re saying is, due to the magnitude of the speed, as you are developing this PM method, it’s not just about continuing to move. It’s about what you do going into that move, which are these other two steps, right? And I agree with that because the problem is, when you move and chaos gets introduced or change happens at a high speed, one degree can go wrong really quickly, right?

And so that’s why I think, even though you might be moving and going, you’re right—stress levels are higher, anxiety levels are higher, and levels of mental uncertainty are higher. Because you’re moving super fast, but now you are really uncertain as to what’s going on. So I think that’s a really significant point. So, take us now and keep going through what you bring into that move step.

I think the easiest way—just at a high level—is to tell you what those two components, before we get to the move, actually do.

So often, when I’m speaking to an audience—if it’s a live audience anyway—I basically just say, “Raise your hand when I say the location where you have your best thinking.”

I always play a little bit of a trick on them, and I say, “The first place: the office.” And nobody puts their hand up.

Unless they’re sitting next to the boss! Then you see them shyly put their hand up because they don’t want to be out of favor.

Exactly. But as soon as you start saying locations, you can see it click. You’ve probably got a location already in your mind. And as soon as I say, “The shower,” people immediately nod.

I was just about to say, “The shower.” Best ideas I’ve ever had!

Yes, and that’s the number one answer! Now, the point I tell you is because this is all about this pause phase.

What you are demonstrating to yourself here—what’s probably just clicked for you—is that it’s got nothing to do with the location. There is nothing magic about your shower.

There’s nothing magical about the water dripping down on you that’s giving you these incredible breakthrough aha moments. It’s all to do with the state you’re in.

This is where we start looking at stress. When we’re in a very low-stress state—scientifically, we call it “joy,” which is the opposite of being stressed out—we are not only able to access breakthroughs, creative thinking, and abstract thinking, but we’re also able to engage with others.

We’re able to be intimate—not just social, but actually intimate. If you look at how we see the world, our outlook completely changes.

When we’re stressed out, we’re typically pessimistic. And that’s really good from an evolutionary point of view. When we were facing a lion, a saber-toothed tiger, or a tribesman with a club, it didn’t really pay to be optimistic. It paid us to be pessimistic because we’re wired that way.

But if we bring that into the modern world, operating from a point of stress means you’re seeing threats, not opportunities.

This is really basic stuff, but this is the point of the pause.

We are not taught to pause because we focus so much on efficiency at the other end—on speed. Actually, if you go back to the very early time management systems, brought out in the late 1800s as part of the Industrial Revolution, there was this whole move to say that if you weren’t maxing out—if you weren’t working as hard as you possibly could—you were lazy.

Yeah, and you’d feel guilty. It became culture.

Exactly—culture and society have run with that. And that’s fine when the world isn’t going at three million miles an hour around us. But when it is, you need that pause.

You need it to take stock, to find a new perspective on what’s going on, to actually gain multiple perspectives, and to reduce that stress level down. The pause is about self-mastery. There is no point going further in a decision if you’re in a stress state.

So the pause is all about recognizing an opportunity to change your state.

Absolutely.

It’s inner work because then you’re more prepared to be able to deal with the change.

Exactly.

Got it. I love that. I love the way you put that, too. Not just because I’ve interviewed a lot of individuals—Tony Robbins talks about changing your state, and there are ways to change your state. I think sometimes we proactively try to change our state, but the word pause—for me, that is such a great word because it’s a universal word that also indicates changing your state. Take a pause. Take a moment. I love that.

And from a linguistic point of view, it signifies that action is going to come. It’s not stop. You’ve chosen to step back.

In a fast-moving world, where businesses are being disrupted by AI, machine learning, cultural change, and natural environments—other competitors rising up—that stepping back is one of the most important things any entrepreneur, business leader, or decision-maker can ever master.

And the really sad thing is, we’re never taught it.

Especially as a leader. I love that you mentioned that because most people listening to this podcast—you might be at home, in your relationship, in your business, whatever—but most people, they’re in a leadership-type role. So there’s a level of responsibility that comes, a level of expectation that comes.

So the stress levels are already a lot higher. And there’s a feeling of, “I can’t pause, I can’t break, I can’t stop.” But then there’s also this other side of that, which is: You need to be an effective leader. And to do that, you’ve got to be able to take a step back.

And the challenge, Chris—I agree with you—is that sometimes people feel like the challenge is, “Is that pause going to set me back?” And so it’s a mind shift you’ve got to do where you start to recognize personal development, personal growth, mastery—it’s not just taking breaks. It’s about pushing forward, and it’s about more growth. But it requires you to do that.

I talk to several people all the time—not to disrupt our thought process here—but they always say, “I always feel like I’m taking two steps forward, one step back.” And I say, “Maybe you need to take two steps back to take three steps forward.” And then they go, “Whoa, I never thought about that.” So anyway, I love that. I love how you’re doing this and tagging it to leaders. So keep going on the pause.

Yeah, so in the PM method course, we describe this pause as “The Paradox of Pausing” to address that exact point.

Because we do—we have this intellectual fightback against it. It’s not even something conscious for most people. They’re just scared that if they do pause, as you say, “What happens? I’ll stop achieving. I’ll stop being successful. I’ll stop moving forward.”

And it’s like, absolutely not. The opposite will happen—you’ve just got to trust the process.

So we’ve just spent about five minutes going through the pause. In the course, we spend a session and a half—three hours or so—digging into that. Because what’s important here is people also understand the patterns that stop them from pausing.

We all run with scripts. If you think about it, we pick up narratives and beliefs—often subconsciously—as children. Some of them come from culture, some come from our parents, some come from teachers, and some come from our early work life.

And unless we go in and challenge those, it’s very hard to make lasting habitual change—to change our habits.

And people don’t recognize it as well, right? Like, they don’t recognize it. I have people tell me all the time, “I think this.” And I go, “Yeah, but if your actions aren’t matching what you’re saying, then it’s doubtful you believe it.” And it’s your beliefs that drive your actions. And so if they don’t recognize it, I think you’re right—that’s a huge point.

Absolutely. And one of the beautiful things that comes out of this is, as people learn to pause, their awareness grows.

This is one of the things that is so phenomenal to see: they actually start to live Pareto’s 80/20 Law. They start to realize—they’ve probably gone, “Oh, yeah, I know that 80% of my work isn’t going to be the most productive, and 20% is going to bring me 80% of my profits,” or whatever.

But when you actually bring it into self-mastery and self-energy—the energy you are putting into your work—you start to see where the 20% is.

You’re killing me with this, brother. I gotta tell you—my podcast yesterday was literally on two rules: the 80/20 Pareto and Parkinson’s Law. And it’s just serendipitous that we’re talking. And this won’t be back-to-back in the podcast, but I love that you brought that up because that could be something everyone that’s listened to this podcast has heard in the past. Why are they not doing it? Why do they not recognize it? And awareness is the key. You hit it right on the head.

And if we don’t stop and pause and step back, we can’t ever hope to see where those things fit in our own lives.

We’re very good, actually, at seeing them in a business sense—e.g., 20% of my profits come from this department. But when it comes to the inner game, the inner working, we’re terrible. We just push forward and hope that we hit the 20% somewhere, expending all our energy on the 80%.

Then what happens—typically, and this is where it gives up another level—is you start to see people just go, “Oh my word, I can actually see my values.”

They thought they had them, but now they’re in color—they were previously in black and white. And it’s these kinds of things, which they sound very much like soft skills, but they become so real and tangible.

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The Importance of Playfulness in Adulthood

When they become so real and tangible, they become the biggest motivators that make you push through anything. So that’s the pause phase, which then blends into kind of the play phase. And playfulness—if we think pausing has been neglected—adult playfulness, it’s almost non-existent for most high-end achievers.

Yeah, absolutely. Because it’s the opposite of what we’re taught. As kids, playfulness is second nature. We just get up, we play with anything. Playfulness teaches kids to be resilient. It teaches them to go outside their comfort zone. It teaches them to cooperate with others.

And then, as soon as you become an adult, society dictates to you that, “Oh, you should stop playing because that’s what kids do. And as an adult, if you want to be successful, you should be stressed and serious.”

Guess what? Everybody buys into it. And as soon as—we’ve already talked a little bit about stress—as soon as you adopt that mantra, and you just go, “I’m stressed because that’s what successful people are,” then you’ve started to write this pattern in you that is self-defeating.

And this is where recent research, thankfully, is starting to catch up. We’ve been researching playfulness in kids for decades.

We’ve completely neglected it in adults. But what we see is that playfulness, as an attitude—and I have to be careful here, and I’ll just clarify exactly what I mean—being playful as an adult in work isn’t being silly. It isn’t being irreverent. It isn’t taking problems less seriously.

It’s taking yourself less seriously, and you're thinking less seriously.

And so what you find is playful individuals arrive at a problem, and they tend to smile. They just go, “Okay, this is a challenge. This is a game. I can’t quite see the solution yet, but I’m going to keep turning this around until I see it from every perspective.” And what you find is that playfulness actually brings in some amazing qualities that the very best businesses thrive on. These are: encouraging curiosity, encouraging collaboration, and encouraging experimentation.

Now, businesses try to encourage these qualities. They send employees on a team-building day, hoping they’ll come back reinvigorated. But that’s not it. It’s a mindset. And you can teach yourself to have this mindset.

I love how you do that, by the way. The science and the thinking, and the science and people—and you hate to have to do that—but I think by doing that, people feel more understood and secure with these concepts. And I think you’re right. It’s a frame of mind. Playfulness—it’s not the activity itself.

Exactly. And when you realize that this is coming from research, it’s not just a lovely idea of, “Sit back, pause, and then be playful, and life will be good.” No. The science backs this up.

And when you start seeing the business leaders who really embrace this—there are business leaders out there who naturally get this. You could name some of the most creative thinkers.

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Historical Examples of Playfulness

One of my favorite historical examples is Ernest Shackleton. If you don’t know who he is, he was the captain of the ill-fated voyage into Antarctica. His ship got caught on the ice, and his crew was trapped on an ice field for 10 months before the ship finally sank.

After that, Shackleton and his crew had to take a small lifeboat and row 800 miles across some of the roughest oceans in the world. It’s considered one of the most incredible rescue missions of all time.

Shackleton once said that the way he picked his crew was by looking for optimism. Now, optimism is important, but it’s different from playfulness. If Shackleton were alive today, I don’t think he’d use the word optimism as we define it now.

Optimism today is often thought of as having a sunny disposition or seeing everything as positive. But Shackleton was talking about something much deeper. He said, “I look for people who can laugh in the face of thirst.”

That’s not modern optimism. That’s playfulness.

Laughing in the face of thirst, in the middle of a life-threatening situation, is a mindset. It’s seeing challenges as part of a game.

When you look at adventurers, leaders, and people who’ve pushed themselves to the extremes, you’ll see they naturally embody this mindset. But the truth is, it’s not something you’re born with. It’s something you can program into yourself.

So, are you saying this mindset can be cultivated?

Absolutely. It’s not just about identifying it in others. This is something leaders can instill in themselves, their teams, and their organizations. Playfulness can—and should—be cultivated, not just admired.

To cultivate playfulness as a leader, the first step is safety. Without safety, playfulness can’t thrive.

Think of high-stress environments where leaders try to implement team-building exercises. Employees may participate for a day, but they know that tomorrow, it’s back to the grind. If the workplace isn’t safe, the playfulness won’t stick.

Got it. So how do you go from safety to playfulness?

Once you’ve established safety, you can start with small, intentional disruptions to the status quo. For example:

• Designate 10 minutes a day for a playful challenge. Maybe write with your non-dominant hand in a meeting.
• Create a game around decision-making. One company I know gave each employee $300 to learn something entirely unrelated to their job. Employees returned with new skills—from bread baking to rowing—and shared them with the team.

Playfulness doesn’t mean taking problems less seriously. It means taking yourself less seriously.

I love that distinction. Playfulness isn’t silly. It’s about perspective.

Exactly. And it’s about cultivating an environment where curiosity, collaboration, and experimentation can thrive.

When leaders model this behavior, it filters through the entire organization. A playful mindset can transform a company culture from toxic to thriving.

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The PM Method and Its Impact

This is why the PM Method is so powerful. It’s designed to help entrepreneurs, CEOs, and leaders embrace this mindset. The impact isn’t just on the individual—it’s on the entire organization.

When leaders learn to pause, play, and move, they unlock their full potential. And that’s when businesses truly thrive.

To start implementing the PM Method in your life or organization, here are a few practical strategies:

1. Master the Pause:
   
   • Schedule intentional pauses throughout your day. Start small with a 5-10 minute break where you step away from tasks, emails, and distractions. Use this time to reflect, breathe, or even take a short walk.
   • Develop self-awareness. Keep a journal to note when you feel overwhelmed or stressed. This helps identify patterns that prevent you from pausing.
2. Cultivate Playfulness:
   
   • Encourage creativity by disrupting routines. For example, hold brainstorming sessions where no idea is off-limits, no matter how unconventional.
   • Reframe challenges as games. If you face a complex problem, challenge your team to think of the most absurd solutions first, just to get creativity flowing.
   • Lead by example. Show your team that it’s okay to experiment and take risks by celebrating failures as learning opportunities.
3. Move with Intention:
   
   • Once you’ve paused and explored playful approaches, act decisively. The move phase is about execution, but with the clarity and energy gained from the first two steps.
   • Set realistic goals that align with the insights gained during the pause and play phases.
   • Focus on what truly matters. Use the 80/20 rule to prioritize high-impact actions over busywork.

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Conclusion

I want to leave you with this thought: The challenges we face today are immense, but so is our potential to adapt and overcome. By mastering the PM Method, you’ll not only build resilience but also create opportunities for innovation, collaboration, and growth.

Take the first step. Pause. Reflect. Reframe. And remember, it’s never too late to start living the life you’re meant to live.

Chris, thank you for sharing your insights with us. This has been one of the most impactful discussions we’ve had on the podcast. I know our listeners will take so much value from this.

Thank you so much for having me on. This has been an incredible conversation.

Absolutely. To everyone listening, share this episode with someone who needs to hear it. And as always, stay tuned for more strategies to help you live your best life. This is George Wright III, signing off from The Daily Mastermind. Have an amazing day!

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About CHRIS MARSHALL:

In an era marked by swift changes and constant disruption, the path ahead can seem daunting for even the most seasoned business leaders. Chris Marshall, widely renowned as the ‘Uncertainty Scientist’, combines his expertise as both a professional futurist and behavioural scientist to assist with this challenge. In 2022, Chris published the book "Decoding Change", helping people step back from the rapid changes ongoing and recognize the true driving forces shaping this new era. Chris is also the founder and creator of the PPM Method (Pause, Play, Move Method), built on the latest neuroscience and stress research. It provides entrepreneurs, decision-makers, and leaders with the tools to master disruption, cultivate their best thinking, and build resilient teams.

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Guest Resources:

PPM Method website: PPMmethod.com

Decoding Change Book: chrismarshall.uk

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About George Wright III:

George Wright is a Proven, Successful Entrepreneur- and he knows how to inspire entrepreneurs, companies, and individuals to achieve Massive Results. With more than 20 years of Executive Management experience and 25 years of Direct Marketing and Sales experience, George is responsible for starting and building several successful multimillion-dollar companies. He started at a very young age to network and build his experience and knowledge of what it takes to become a driven and well-known entrepreneur. George built a multi-million-dollar seminar business, promoting some of the biggest stars and brands in the world. He has accelerated the success and cash flow in each of his ventures through his network of resources and results driven strategies. George is now dedicated to teaching and sharing his Prosperity Principles and Strategies to every Driven and Passionate Entrepreneur he meets. His mission is to Empower Entrepreneurs Globally to create Massive Change and LIVE their Ultimate Destiny.

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