Profit with Presence with Dr. Eric Holsapple TB

Dr. Eric Holsapple on Leading with Presence

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Welcome back to The Daily Mastermind, George Wright III, with your daily dose of inspiration, motivation, and education. I'm joined today by an amazing leadership host, topic CEO. I'm going to give them an introduction in a minute here, but Dr. Eric, how are you doing today?

I'm doing great, George. Thanks for having me on.

Oh, man, it's a pleasure. We have some very similar backgrounds. I'm super excited. So listen, guys, buckle up. I want to give you a quick little background.

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Dr. Eric Holsapple's Background and Achievements

We've got a very diverse guest, one that I really feel will bring some value to you today. He's a PhD in economics. He's got a real estate background and has been a CEO in real estate development for over 40 years. But he's also rounded it off, I feel, with this idea that he's practiced yoga and meditation for over 30 years. He's had the Entrepreneur of the Year Award a couple of times, and he's the author of the book Profit with Presence and the founder of Living in the Gap. We're going to talk a little bit more about Living in the Gap, but his company focuses on teaching CEOs and professionals different ways to operate in mindfulness and still grow.

So with that introduction, I would love it if you'd give us just a little bit of your background and this bridge that came from entrepreneurship or business into mindfulness. Give us a little bit of the backstory.

I'd be happy to. I was raised in rural Maine and went to the University of Maine and then out to Colorado State University. I got an MBA and always worked, but I got my first job in real estate after that MBA. I was immediately successful in real estate. Within a couple of years, I was a general manager and then president shortly thereafter of a North American division of an Australian company.

I started in Denver and then moved to Los Angeles, traveling between Denver, Princeton, New Jersey, Western Canada, and reporting to the UK and Australia. I had all the outward signs of success. I had the six-figure salary, the Mercedes, the apartment. I had all those things. But I was not happy. I was overweight. I was single.

I remember my 30th birthday and a little bit after that, I got transferred to Boston to help with a company there. I couldn't button my top shirt button for my tie or my belt, and I wasn't giving in. I finally got an apartment there with a scale. I remember stepping on it and thinking, "God, you better make some changes, or you're not going to be around very long." I had one of those aha moments. So I made some changes. I left that job, lost a bunch of weight, started running again, and found yoga. That was my first entry into mindfulness.

I had been an athlete growing up but hadn't done anything in four or five years. I got back into sports. My older brother, at the time estranged from the family, was a poet, and my dad was a football coach. They were like oil and water. For 10 years or so, he didn’t come around the family much. Then I watched my older brother take up meditation and come back to the family. He got closer to my dad. My dad didn’t change—he was in his seventies—but he opened up. I got my family back. My brother said, “Hey, you want to try it?” I said, “Sure, I’ll try it.”

So I tried meditation and had immediate results. I felt less stress, more focus, and improved relationships. My sports improved, and I was just happier. But for a lot of years, I didn’t come out as a meditator. I just did it on my own for 10 to 15 years. Gradually, as I got through my PhD program, back into developing with my own company, teaching on the side, and raising a family, people started noticing changes in me.

People started coming up to me saying, "What are you doing? I have this problem. What do you do? What do you know?" They noticed changes in me. I became someone easier to talk to than I had been historically because I run 150 miles an hour—I'm a hard-charging guy.

Anyway, we started a seed group at our company where we would just read a book and talk about centering. We didn’t get weird or woo about meditation; we just talked about centering and read books. Before I knew it, the room was full. The management committee got together and changed the vision statement to 'mindfully creating community.' Everyone started getting involved in nonprofits, giving back, putting their families first, and making changes.

It made a huge difference—the same difference I noticed in my life, I saw others experience. Later, I launched Living in the Gap, a nonprofit where we train others to do that.

And what I’ve really found—I love capitalism—but for capitalism to work, people have to give back when they can.

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You have to. That’s...yeah, I totally agree with that. It’s funny—I feel like our stories are very similar. I’m learning more and more that when I interact with people, they have similar stories as well: chasing success, getting that success, realizing it’s not the end-all, be-all, and it’s not making them happy.

I’ve got a question for you. It’s one that maybe you have an answer to, or maybe you have multiple answers to. You mentioned an aha moment. Do you think it was several years or a period of time? What do you think it was that caused this need or shift? Was it an aha moment? Or was it that you accomplished success but found it unfulfilling? What do you think it is? Because I had a similar type of experience.

I think it was both for me. But generally, I call it in my book a cultural lie. We’ve been raised to believe that if we do all the right things—study hard, get into the right schools, get the degree, get the right job, meet the ideal spouse, get married, have the family, have the two houses and the cars, and get these ideal vacations—that someday we get to be happy.

What I found for myself and many other successful people I’ve been friends with over the years is that we just keep moving the goalposts. We say, “Oh, it’s not this house, it’s that house. It’s the second car. Or I want to travel, so I’ll fly. I want to fly first class. No, I’d like to fly private. Now I want to take a trip to the moon.” We keep changing the goalposts.

That’s that hot dog on a string—happiness. Harvard’s done a lot of work on this. It’s like what Copernicus said: The sun doesn’t revolve around the earth; the earth revolves around the sun. Similarly, success revolves around happiness. Happy people are more successful.

We all know people who are monetarily successful but not happy. We also know people who have very little and are happy. But I think you can have it all. You can have those material things, but you have to realize that happiness doesn’t come from them. Happiness doesn’t come from just that pot of gold. You’ve got to have happiness to enjoy the pot of gold.

Yeah. I’m a big advocate of the fact that you can’t just achieve happiness; you’ve got to be happily achieving. And I think that’s exactly the shift to mindfulness, which is now taking the success you’ve had and bridging it into a mission, a purpose, a thing you’re doing with the book, your company, and Living in the Gap.

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Mindfulness in Business

Help me understand how you tie mindfulness into leadership and business. Sometimes people aren’t aware of the need for mindfulness until it’s past the point of wishing they had it. How do you bring mindfulness into leadership and business? How does mindfulness pertain to business, and how do you try to tie the two together for people?

Efficiency and focus. First of all, on a personal level, it’s stress reduction. It makes you more grateful, makes you happier, and improves your relationships. But to make the business case for it, you have to show it improves business outcomes. In my case, it has.

I’m sure there are instances where people say, “I don’t want to do this anymore,” but most people feel like, “Oh, someday, when I get to be successful, I’ll start being mindful.” My belief is that if I’m focusing on a meeting, it means my phone and apps aren’t open. I’m actually talking to the person in the meeting.

When I’m focused, I can move the world in a few hours a day. If I’m distracted and divided, I can spend 12 hours a day and get very little done. There are so many options for our attention that we have to decide to reclaim it and focus on what we choose.

I totally agree. And I think entrepreneurs and CEOs often believe that the hustle is what has gotten them to where they are. When you shift to mindfulness, they worry it might feel like taking their foot off the gas. How do you explain to people that being mindful actually enhances focus, efficiency, and productivity, rather than taking their edge away?

For most producers, you can’t stop producing even if you want to. People fear they’ll lose their edge. There’s a guy named George Mumford who worked with Phil Jackson during the Bulls and Lakers days. He coached Kobe Bryant and told Kobe, “Go out there tonight and try not to score.”

Kobe ended up scoring 60 points by passing more and focusing on opportunities, rather than forcing things. For real producers, it’s in their DNA—it’s not something they’ll stop doing.

But what’s the purpose of it if you don’t enjoy it or aren’t making the difference you can make? Profit isn’t a purpose; it’s the result of a purpose-driven life that meets a need. I love capitalism, but profit is a result, not the end-all, be-all.

I love what you said. I want to make a note of this and really point out to our listeners the idea that if you've been working most of your life, developing habits for production, and you're a producer or a performer, you've likely developed those habits. You don’t necessarily need to focus on them anymore. In other words, you can take that natural ability, now that you've developed those habits of success, and focus on something with more purpose and presence. Trust yourself.

Exactly. Trust yourself. If I had to make the choice to produce a little less to be happier, more satisfied, and have better relationships, I’d choose that. But in my experience, you actually get more done in less time and make a bigger difference.

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12 Pillars of Mindful Leadership

So, talk to me a little bit about the book. I love the title, Profit with Presence, and this idea of the 12 Pillars of Leadership. Do you want to take a minute and walk us through some of those?

Sure. The idea is that I’ve been in the mindfulness community for a while. What I’ve noticed is that not all, but a lot of people in the mindfulness community, think money is dirty—it taints you. On the other hand, people in the business community think mindfulness is “woo.”

I’ve been able to bridge that gap and show that mindfulness is about focus and presence. We live in a capitalist society, and it’s absurd to think that making money makes you dirty. I buck that notion. We’re householders, not renunciants living on a hill in India. I run a business, I have a family, and I have responsibilities. It’s okay for me to make money. But what do I do with it?

I make my life better, my family’s life better, and the community better. Profit with Presence is about doing both—making money and being mindful.

The 12 Pillars of Mindful Leadership start with what I call the foundational pillars. The first three are:

1. Be present and practice mindfulness. Everything of consequence—whether it’s athletics, music, or business—takes practice, and so does mindfulness. Develop practices that allow you to be more present in your life.
2. Identify your purpose in life. Purpose isn’t about profit. One inner purpose is to be awake and present. Life is a blessing, and recognizing that is a purpose in itself.
3. Create clarity, vision, intention, commitment, and habits. Clarity comes from mindfulness and purpose. Studies show that visioning can be as effective as taking action. Intentions are powerful. Commitment and habits must align—if your habits don’t support your commitments, it’s hard to live up to them.

I love the foundational aspect because I think a lot of times people, especially as they get older or more established in their careers, feel like they’ve already set up foundational things. But as you said, sometimes their habits and commitments don’t line up. Until you consciously work through that process, you don’t see the disconnect.

Exactly. And that disconnect is often what keeps people from achieving their greatness.

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Starting with Mindfulness

Let me ask you a question: for professionals—CEOs or business owners—who are limited on time, where do you recommend they start with mindfulness? Is it a practice, a course? Where should someone start to incorporate mindfulness into their daily life?

The key is that it takes less to get started than most people think. Consistency matters more than the length of time. With meditation, I recommend starting with just two minutes. Build up from there until it becomes a habit.

The mind is so busy when we first start that jumping into 20 or 30 minutes can be counterproductive. What’s important is to do whatever keeps you consistent.

The lowest-hanging fruit is gratitude. The impact is immediate, and the science is irrefutable. Starting with gratitude—just having the intention to be more mindful—can create significant changes.

Another simple practice is a mindful walk. Take 10 minutes at lunch, leave your phone behind, and just walk. If you’re scrolling on your phone during the walk, it’s not mindful. We can unplug for 10 minutes and reconnect with nature or simply observe our surroundings.

Start small. Be consistent. Maybe pick up a little book on mindfulness. As you practice, you’ll become more efficient, and it will naturally expand into other areas of your life.

You made a great point that many of these topics are practices. Even gratitude is a practice—I do it every morning. Identifying moments of gratitude is a simple but powerful habit.

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Living in the Gap

One of my last questions is about your company, Living in the Gap. I don’t want to make assumptions, but I’m guessing it relates to bridging profit and presence. What does the name mean to you?

There are many gaps, but the primary one is creating space between thoughts and recognizing who you truly are. In those gaps—those spaces between thoughts—is where peace, joy, and happiness reside. Stress and anxiety come from how we think about things, not the things themselves.

Most of us have hobbies like painting, skiing, or fly fishing, where we create those gaps and are fully present. The goal is to bring that presence into other parts of life, like work.

I also think this is a big point: what’s your intention with the gaps? Most people’s intention is to fill them. If there’s a gap, they feel the need to fill it—scrolling through

email, TV, Netflix, or whatever. But if your intention is to create more gaps, that’s where fulfillment and happiness come from. So, here’s a question for the audience: what’s your intention with the gaps? Is it to create more gaps or to fill them? I would argue that peace, fulfillment, and happiness come from creating more gaps.

That’s such a great question. And you’re absolutely right. When our intention is to create space and embrace those gaps, we find more joy and balance. This has been a wonderful discussion.

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Conclusion and Call to Action

I completely agree. This has been a fantastic conversation. I think we might want to dive deeper into this with our academy members. But at the end of the day, where’s the best place for people to connect with you, learn more about what you do, and get more information on mindfulness and leadership?

Check out our website, livinginthegap.org. We have free resources on how to get started with mindfulness and details on our programs. The book, Profit with Presence, also outlines a process for awakening and becoming more purposeful—not just at home but also at work. We spend more time at work than anywhere else, so it’s important to bring mindfulness there as well.

That’s fantastic. I’ll include the link to your site and the book in our show notes. To everyone listening, definitely grab a copy of the book. If you’re a high performer, CEO, business owner, or investor, find those opportunities to create more gaps. It’ll not only bring more fulfillment but also improve focus, clarity, and productivity.

I believe it’s never too late to start practicing mindfulness, and it can go a long way for you. Dr. Eric, I really appreciate you being here. This has been an incredible discussion.

Thanks for having me, George. It’s been a pleasure.

All right, everybody, don’t forget to share the show! Hit me up on The Daily Mastermind on Instagram or Facebook and let me know your thoughts. Let me know how we can bring more mindfulness into your profession, life, business, and relationships. I look forward to connecting with you again. This is George Wright III, and this has been The Daily Mastermind.

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About Dr. Eric Holsapple

Dr. Eric Holsapple is a successful developer and entrepreneur with LC Real Estate Group, in Loveland, Colorado, who has used mindfulness to transform his life and business, and helps others to do the same.

Eric is the founder of Living in the Gap where he teaches CEOs and professionals a different way to operate mindfully while improving the bottom line.

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Guest Resources:

http://www.livinginthegap.org

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About George Wright III:

George Wright is a Proven, Successful Entrepreneur- and he knows how to inspire entrepreneurs, companies, and individuals to achieve Massive Results. With more than 20 years of Executive Management experience and 25 years of Direct Marketing and Sales experience, George is responsible for starting and building several successful multimillion-dollar companies. He started at a very young age to network and build his experience and knowledge of what it takes to become a driven and well-known entrepreneur. George built a multi-million-dollar seminar business, promoting some of the biggest stars and brands in the world. He has accelerated the success and cash flow in each of his ventures through his network of resources and results driven strategies. George is now dedicated to teaching and sharing his Prosperity Principles and Strategies to every Driven and Passionate Entrepreneur he meets. His mission is to Empower Entrepreneurs Globally to create Massive Change and LIVE their Ultimate Destiny.

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